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 Document 8 of 17                                                 Page   1
 Classification:   UNCLASSIFIED       Status:        [STAT]
 Document Date:    01 Aug 90          Category:      [CAT]
 Report Type:      JPRS Report        Report Date:
 Report Number:    JPRS-UAC-91-001    UDC Number:
 Author(s):  Major I. Kuznetsov under rubric "Our Interview Guest" :
 'k%The Flight That Did Not Occur"; uncaptioned photograph
 of Major General of Aviation Leonov included]
 Headline:   Maj Gen Avn Leonov on Soviet Lunar Program Details
 Source Line:  91UM0064J Moscow AVIATSIYA I KOSMONAVTIKA in Russian No
 8, Aug 90 (signed to press 18 Jul 90) pp 44-45
 Subslug:   [Interview of Major General of Aviation Aleksey Arkhipovich
 Leonov, USSR Pilot-Cosmonaut, Twice-Honored HSU, by Major
 I. Kuznetsov under rubric "Our Interview Guest": "The
 Flight That Did Not Occur"; uncaptioned photograph of
 Major General of Aviation Leonov included)
 PULL TEXT OF ARTICLE:
 1.  [Interview of Major General of Aviation Aleksey Arkhipovich
 Leonov, USSR Pilot-Cosmonaut, Twice-Honored HSU, by Major I.
 Kuznetsov under rubric "Our Interview Guest": "The Flight That Did
 Not Occur"; uncaptioned photograph of Major General of Aviation
 Leonov included]
 2.  [Text] Major General of Aviation A. Leonov, USSR Pilot-Cosmonaut,
 Twice-Honored HSU, tells about the Soviet lunar program and
 contemporary problems of cosmonautics.
 3.  [Kuznetsov] Aleksey Arkhipovich, the journal's readers are
 interested in "gaps" in the history of Soviet cosmonautics.  One of
 them is our manned lunar program, in which you had occasion to
 participate. Share your recollections.
 4.  [Leonov] The Soviet manned lunar program envisaged two stages:
 the first was a flyby of the Moon and the second was a manned landing
 on the Moon, and its technical director was Hero of Socialist Labor
 Vasiliy Pavlovich Mishin.
 5.  The first stage in the mid-1960's--that was when Center
 specialists joined in fulfilling it--was viewed realistically: the
 Proton booster rocket already was flying and the Soyuz craft, named
 L-1 in the lunar version, was being materialized in metal. The second
 was problematical, but we believed that it would be carried out. Back
 before the decision was made on realizing the lunar program, Sergey
 Pavlovich Korolev told us about the powerful N-i booster and L-3
 UNCLASSIFIED     Approved for Release
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 craft which his collective was working to create. At that time we
 thought that the lunar program was designed for many years. We argued
 about projects for creating lunar settlements and flights to planets
 of the solar system. All this was so, but life showed that our dreams
 outstripped real events.
 6.  The booster intended for accomplishing the lunar flyby program
 had been made and had given a good account of itself, but the first
 launch of the Zond--that was the name of the L-1 craft in the
 automatic version--was unsuccessful. Why? A booster module (the D
 unit) was placed on the Proton to reach parabolic velocity, but the
 switching of commands was confused in it and it decelerated instead
 of accelerating. The craft had to be liquidated. This was the first
 alarm signal. The next launch vent normally, but later there again
 was a booster malfunction. After functioning for several seconds, it
 fell not far from the launch site. It turned out that a rubber plug
 had fallen into the manifold ahead of the turbopump assembly.  Having
 gotten stuck in the line, it cut off the fuel feed. Subsequently
 serious troubles leading to flight disruptions were repeated every
 other time.
 7.  It was learned in 1968 that we would not perform this mission
 before the Americans. One reason was the absence of proper financing
 and an incorrect distribution of assets.
 8.  [Kuznetsov] You said that main efforts were aimed at realizing
 the L-1 program. How did the cosmonauts prepare for it?
 9.  [Leonov] A total of some 20 persons prepared for the lunar
 program. The first crews consisting of Leonov and Makarov and of
 Bykovskiy and Rukavishnikov were made up from them. Believing in the
 feasibility of the set goals, the entire group began work actively,
 since each one thought that with a successful flyby of the Moon he
 automatically would go over to the next stage for the L-3.  Therefore
 training also proceeded with promise. We mastered many simulators,
 including a dynamic simulator created on the basis of a helicopter,
 and vent through test pilot school at the, Flying Research Institute.
 Realizing that the lunar landing was the most difficult element, we
 learned the ability to choose a site in a short time, land the craft
 with limited fuel reserves, and instantaneously evaluate vertical
 velocity.
 10.  The landing approach on the return from the Moon was to have
 been from the direction of the Antarctic. We even flew in Somalia in
 order to have a good knowledge of constellations near the Southern
 Cross. The craft had a star-tracker and sextant for autonomous
 navigation, and the cosmonauts devoted much time to studying these
 instruments. In the final account everyone learned to work with full
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 understanding of the dynamics of a lunar flyby.
 11.  To practice a landing on Earth at parabolic velocity,
 specialists developed a precise, detailed methodology with two
 entries. We had to learn to choose the angle of entry after the last
 correction using the star-tracker and sextant. It depended on the
 magnitude and direction of the deceleration pulse. It was possible to
 "bury" oneself in the atmosphere with a large angle and to "slip
 through" it with a small angle. The optimum version was an entry
 with a "pop-up": enter, exit the atmosphere after extinguishing
 great speed, and reenter, already knowing the angle of incidence at
 which the craft had to be held in order to get to the calculated
 landing point.  The "manual pulse input" instrument highlighted the
 number of pulses after passage of the first sector. From them we
 figured the distance to the calculated landing point, then converted
 distance into angle of incidence.  All these operations were
 rehearsed on the " Volchok" dynamic simulator. As a result we
 learned to make a "landing" with an accuracy to on kilometer. After
 taking tests on craft design and flight program, the cosmonauts were
 ready to fly around the Moon.
 12.  The flight would be difficult even from a purely everyday
 aspect, since the L-1 did not have an orbital module as did the
 Soyuz, and two persons had to be in the descent module for a week. We
 followed the last unmanned flight with hope, but when the frontal
 shield was fired off, the command also was sent to fire the parachute
 system. The craft was flattened after falling to Earth. It was
 curious that part of the film which it delivered was preserved.  This
 allowed us to be first to obtain beautiful, exceptionally precise
 photographs of Earth from the direction of the Moon.
 13.  The Americans flew around the Moon in Apollo 8 in December 1968
 and our leaders shivered: "Do we have to do this now?" General
 Designer Mishin nevertheless got to conduct one more test flight in
 an automatic version, and again a failure: a disturbance of the
 flight configuration led to depressurization of the body. We will add
 to this that all three launches of the N-i booster rocket during
 flight-design tests were unsuccessful. After soberly assessing the
 situation, the government shut down the program connected with a
 manned lunar landing.
 14.  [Kuznetsov] Aleksey Arkhipovich, did our plan differ from the
 American plan?
 15.  [Leonov] Our lunar lander was similar to the American one, and
 the flight schemes, as Kondratyuk had foreseen them, did not differ
 at all. The craft had to enter a base circumlunar orbit, and a
 capsule would separate from it which would make a soft landing on the
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 Moon. True, in contrast to the American one, the capsule was to hold
 one person, but actions on the Moon and the return to Earth coincided
 fully.
 16.  I will remind you that the Soviet Union was performing parallel
 research of the Moon with automatic satellites.  They gave us
 interesting data, even more complete than the Americans had at that
 time, but there also was one other distinction.
 17.  The accident on Apollo 13 connected with the explosion of a fuel
 cell demonstrated the very flexible thinking of U.S. leaders. By
 telling about everything honestly, they were able to unite the entire
 nation in those days.  Literally all America followed this flight,
 suffered it, and suggested and thought how to save the crew. But our
 out-of-the-ordinary situations always were concealed in an attempt to
 prove the superiority of Soviet equipment.  As a matter of fact,
 there were enormously more of them than the Americans had, but the
 people were not told about this. Therefore many got the impression
 that mastery of space was a rather simple matter and that upkeep of
 cosmonauts was costing the state dearly and was economically
 inexpedient.
 18.  [Kuznetsov] How did you follow the progress of the Americans'
 fulfillment of the Apollo program?
 19.  [Leonov] The entire world observed man's first landing on the
 Moon except for the Soviet Union and China. But with the exception of
 a maximum of a hundred persons who viewed the reports in one of the
 organizations, no one among Soviet citizens saw the launch of the
 craft and its landing on the Moon or the crew's actions. History
 appraised the merits of our ideologues Ponomarev and Suslov and the
 course along which they led the country.  But the Americans have no
 false morality. In 1965 they gratefully received all our information
 on extravehicular activity and coordinated their program. While at
 first it was planned only to stick a hand out of the craft,
 subsequently they repeated my spacewalk and also used a handheld
 motor which permitted the astronaut somehow to control his body in
 space. Returning to the U.S. lunar program, I will say that there are
 no "gaps" in it for me. Moreover, I recorded the flights of Apollo
 10 through 17 on video cassette.
 20.  [Kuznetsov] Did you see extraterrestrials on your films?  UFO
 specialists assert that the first people on the Moon saw them and
 that extraterrestrials allegedly observed the astronauts. Is this
 true?
 21.  [Leonov] People fond of any sensations wrested a phrase from the
 astronauts' conversation and are building their fantasies on this.
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 Clear communications were established with the Houston Flight Control
 Center after the Moon landing. The picture was being transmitted
 "there" and "back." On emerging from the craft, Neil Armstrong
 stepped to the ground very cautiously, then became bolder; his steps
 became more confident and he began to jump. I looked at these frames.
 James [sic] Aldrin said to him; "Look out, they're watching us."
 "They" in the sense of "Earth." He further advised not to violate
 instructions and to be more cautious. And in fact, after this
 Armstrong began to take normal steps. I told the ufologists this more
 than once: "Why are you speculating? This is in fact not so."
 22.  [Kuznetsov] We created the Buran space shuttle, it went through
 the first tests, but now some such as Academician Sagdeyev are saying
 that it is not necessary. What is your opinion?
 23.  [Leonov] We have the Mir program. If we wish to seriously
 receive dividends, it is necessary to return to Earth materials of
 the studies that have been conducted.  The Soyuz craft can return a
 quantity of cargo that is small in volume and a maximum of 100-120 kg
 in weight. We plan to return tons. This can be done only by the
 Buran. In this connection it is impossible to agree with Academician
 Sagdeyev's opinion that the Buran in general has nothing to do in
 orbit. We need it as a component part of the Mir program's
 transportation system. Sagdeyev is wrong here.
 24.  And further, previously he was silent, but now he objects. It
 would be more ethical for his part to give an account for his subject
 matter: Why did the Phoboses, which he launched and into which great
 assets were placed, fail without having reached the target?
 25.  [Kuznetsov] Here we probably should touch on questions of
 improving the profitability of space?
 26.  [Leonov] Being an embodiment of foremost scientific-technical
 thinking, cosmonautics is really capable of enormously greater
 economic return. Having spent $25 billion on the lunar program, the
 Americans subsequently received a profit twice that by introducing
 new technologies and developments. Our situation is somewhat
 different, but through whose fault? Cosmonautics?
 27.  Back in the 1930's Academician Kapitsa posed a question before
 the Economic Council of the Council of People's Commissars: "What
 incentives for creative innovations are built into the Soviet
 system?" And he answered himself: "I see none." The situation has
 not changed since then. What projects didn't the economists
 substantiate to please the politicians? "Emancipation of peasants,"
 "destruction of unpromising villages," "transfer of northern
 rivers" and others of sad memory.  And to this day the economic
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 mechanism has not been developed for stimulating enterprises'
 introduction of new kinds of products and technologies which, for
 example, now lie unclaimed in excess in the space sector.       Hence the
 conversations about low profitability of space.  But this is not the
 fault, but the misfortune of cosmonautics.
 28.  I remember how we were asked to monitor agricultural lands from
 space. In a 24-hour period we gave out a pile of data, but it
 differed from that which the State Committee for Statistics gives out
 by 25-30 percent, and they turned down our services. But we learned
 that many fields either were smaller than according to the data of
 the Agro-Industrial Committee, or they were not being used, or they
 were not taken into account at all. Results of mismanagement also are
 easily seen from space: trampled-down pastures, ruined rivers and
 reservoirs, and the polluted atmosphere of cities. We can tell, for
 example, about all the outrages which the Ministry of Land
 Reclamation and Water Resources committed on Soviet land. Much is
 being said now about Aral and Balkhash, but the fact is that
 cosmonauts were first to sound the alarm 15 years ago. I myself vent
 to Pelshe, chairman of the Party Control Commission of the CPSU
 Central Committee, and told him what was being done on the
 Baykal-Amur Railroad and Sea of Aral. While they made certain other
 decisions on the Baykal-Amur Railroad at that time, they did not for
 Aral.
 29.  It seems our information is little needed by anyone. I
 personally believe that reproaches on this matter should be addressed
 to the economists above all, and the press must properly arrange the
 emphasis here. Rigid communications, both direct and feedback, is
 needed and then there also will be an economic effect.
 30.  [Kuznetsov] And the last question, which journal readers often
 ask: Do you believe that our contemporaries will be eyewitnesses to
 fulfillment of a Soviet lunar program?
 31.  [Leonov] Such a program is not envisaged before the year 2000.
 But beyond that, we will see.
 32.  COPYRIGHT: " Aviatsiya i kosmonavtika", 1990.

